Some techniques, and things I see go wrong

[Outthouse]

Originally Posted by wahoodad

Jon, we have to fish together sometime amigo

That would be an honor. Got to fish with Fishordie and Fishybuzz this year and that was great. Need to add some other fishing Gods to the list.

[okie man]

Originally Posted by wahoodad

Jon, we have to fish together sometime amigo

I'll answer this with a joke, ok?

Young bull and old bull on top of a hill, looking down at a bunch of cows. Young bull says "Let's run down and each get us one of those!"

Old bull says "Let's walk down and screw em all!"

Anybody that's ever fished with me and paid attention to what I do has seen I do exactly this. I hang in the wheelhouse, help them look when they need help, see the school we are running on, thus I get all the inside dope (are they deep? are they big? etc)
Then, I go over to my rack, select my rod appropriate for the size fish I see boiling, go down to the tank. Now, the other 98% of the boat is in a big cluster$#@*, and there is no line at the bait tank either. Also, they put a fresh scoop of bait in the tray, cause the last one got all used up by the impatient bunch that are now in a big tangle.
I slide over to the downwind corner, all by myself, my bait right where the chum is being thrown, and I hook one and smile.

It ain't rocket science, but some very intelligent people get so caught up in the insanity of boiling fish they miss the most simple approach.

I hate tangles.

why did you have to tell them this one ! there's nothing better than watching the animals get all red faced and ass hurt while you toss a bait off a clear corner and see the boil as a fish inhales your bait . timing is every bit as important as picking a good bait, casting skill and being able to "swim" your bait away from the boat if you ask me!

[eightmd]

David, I have seen some of your posts and I remember one time you said something about lines sawing others off. I believe you said that mono will saw spectra easier than the other way around. I have been wondering about that because everyone always thinks spectra will cut through mono like butter.

I just went to fishing short top shots this year and my last trip I got sawed off a bunch. I'm wondering if I was getting it from mono or other spectra.

When using mono against mono I assume the smaller diameter line will win.

Just wondering what do you think? And if there are good pointers for avoiding getting sawed. I try to loosen up the pressure a little when in a tangle, but not too much.

[wahoodad]

Originally Posted by okie man

why did you have to tell them this one ! there's nothing better than watching the animals get all red faced and ass hurt while you toss a bait off a clear corner and see the boil as a fish inhales your bait . timing is every bit as important as picking a good bait, casting skill and being able to "swim" your bait away from the boat if you ask me!

Because it doesn't matter, they cannot help themselves. You can tell them I have a better way, show them I have a better way, and catch more fish doing it my way. And they'll still mill around the bait tank with sharp elbows, and get in that nausea tangle scenario, and watch me roll by with a bent rod again and again.

[eightmd]

One thing that seems to work is when everyone relaxes a bit. I think that just helps everyone work together. On shorter trips it's so much more competitive because everyone is trying to get fish as fast as they can, but when everyone relaxes a bit and takes it just a little slower things seem to go easier.

Like someone pointed out team work, talking to each other, and learning to work together really helps everyone out.

I think most of us have been on trips when everyone just seems to get a long and works well together. On those trips its amazing how many fish are brought on board with so few arguments, yelling, stressful situations, etc...

[rjgoal]

David - the fruits of your labor have gone full circle - Congrats on the new job!

I use the crew as my personal coach to keep me going when I'm down, and to keep out of hazards...I listen to every word they say before I make the next move...It actually makes time to crank in the big fish quicker. Last year another guy & I had fish on of 150 lbs each next to each other about the same depft in the water column. His fish made left circles & mine made right circles, infact we danced the over & under for about 20 minutes before we seperated. Our lines crossed only the 1st time. The crew coached us through it & we brought each fish to gaff shortly after. I thought it was great fun working as a team with the crew particularly during this episode.

I had a second fish of equal size shortly after and this guy was alot of trouble. If it were not for the crew helping me move around the boat & anchor a few times I would never have landed it. When the deckhands bought it on deck we noticed the circle hook was logged in the tuna's eye lid. Just keeping the right amount of pressure at all times & listening to the crew makes all the difference. After all you guys fish everyday, & for me it's 1-3x a year. Just got me a new 2by4 & can't wait to use it!

Oh yah - for the younsters fishing albacore it pays off to wait for the slide to stop....98% of the lines are way back...no need to wait to find a good bait when your the only one at the tank. The school comes to boat and to sling your bait with an instant hook & take your fish to bow. When I was 12 or 13 wieghing a buck-twenty its not worth competing during a troll hookup. Once the slide stopped I started catching 3x above the average. The funny thing is that the 98% does not know what's your secret....

David - Thanks for all the insight!

[JJONES660]

Originally Posted by SMN XPS

Looking back on my first trip this august, had I gone in with this thinking I would have had a much better time.

I spent way to much time and patience trying to get my bait right into the mess. on the longer stops is when i caught fish, that is also when i got out of the mess of the masses and asked the crew on the tank which bait?, where should I toss it in? then . . . Fish on!

Patience will be my watchword on my next trip, well that's the plan at least.

here is a question for you david,

you mention choosing your rod based on the size of fish you see boiling, well on my trip we made a number of stops while fishing offshore tuna where we circled some marks and the skipper would start a chum line and then say "bring in the trollers" then he would say "lets try it " but we would not have seen any boiling fish. I was fishing 40 lb and never got bit on stops like those even when some, or many, others got fish. I am thinking those were some fish that were being hesitant and that i should have thrown 30 or 25lb line to get bit there. so I am thinking if there's no boils but the skipper says to try it I should trow lighter line. make sense or is there something else going on?

cheers
jerry

Interesting thought....my last season on the spirit it seamed whenever i got a rod in my hand I always chose 5o and could get bit no matter what the bite...schoolies or 100plus it seemed i could hook and hand like it was going out of style even with people fishing 25 and not getting bit....sometimes line doesnt matter as much as hooking the bait and having the presentation of all presentations. I used to be able to cast a 6/0 off the corner like money....who knows now...i got bit on 40 on my last trip out to whip a few schoolies and thought maybe i still got it...dont know my point other than i think presentation and hook size matters more over line size than some think...if you can find a way to get a sardine to haul ass on heavier line you will get bit.......just remember...bluefin whom are supposed to be line shy will still cheew 60 or 80 when a bait is presented right...and as for how a day progresses knowing fish size...usually you have a decent idea on he fish grade...lets face it...most of us have been fishing albies at some point in life and had a captain scream we got some big bluefin...dont throw less than 50! thats why boyscotts motto is be prepared.....as in be prepared for some big ass fish! always have a heavier bait rod on stand by that you can get to in a matter of seconds!

[afraser]

Originally Posted by okie man

why did you have to tell them this one ! there's nothing better than watching the animals get all red faced and ass hurt while you toss a bait off a clear corner and see the boil as a fish inhales your bait . timing is every bit as important as picking a good bait, casting skill and being able to "swim" your bait away from the boat if you ask me!

I take a slight variation to this technique. I do try to be one of the first in, and yes, I let others in so they get their shot too. But, the difference is, before I start going too far down the side of the boat, I usually will pull my bait out and recast a new bait on the backside of the "pack", right where they are throwing the chum. The waiting thing works too, but you do miss those early bites, and on some of these trips, there are only 1 or 2 decent fish on a stop.

As for getting away from the pack, don't just think side to side, think vertically as well. Butt hook the baits, or send them down with some weight. Both will help you clear the tangles.

I do like that 2 crewmen were referred to in this thread giving contrary advice (about holding the spool). Hard to listen to "the crew" in this case . I agree with holding the reel, though.

Cutting off circles advice is great. I learned from someone that sometimes it is better to stay in high gear just to cut off those circles even faster, especially when the fish is doing circles a bit away from the boat.

Gaffing fish. Tough call. I think if a client gets the fish to the surface, he should be able to call for gaff and expect the crew to be there, assuming they aren't otherwise heavily occupied. I don't want to wait until the fish is completely still to call for the gaff, that is just asking for the fish to take a hike.

People actually leave their rod at the rail to get a bait? Really? Really???

Tangles? The crews nowadays are so good with tangles, you'd never think they hated them so much

One last thing, make sure everyone gets a fish or two early and then everyone relaxes faster and works better together. Nothing raises tension like someone (or a few people) sitting on a skunk while some people are catching fish number 5 or 6. Try a hook and hand early in the trip, it goes a long way. Of course, its harder to hand off a tuna on a spinner, some people just don't think that is natural or something

[okie man]

Originally Posted by wahoodad

Because it doesn't matter, they cannot help themselves. You can tell them I have a better way, show them I have a better way, and catch more fish doing it my way. And they'll still mill around the bait tank with sharp elbows, and get in that nausea tangle scenario, and watch me roll by with a bent rod again and again.

you make a good point david! kudos for doing what it takes to stay out on the water also. good luck to ya!

[JJONES660]

afraser

as to your gaffing comment i agree....I do believe a good crew will have a good idea as to where the fish in his vicinity are in relation to there fight...I also believe good communication is key when fighting the fish...I usually let a crew in the area know when im the passenger hey im about 20 feet down color and might need a gave in a couple minutes or something of that nature...just letting them know your close and to keep you in mind can make life easy for them....nothing sucks more than a guy saying hes ready for a gaff on a fish that he sees 40 feet deep while a guy on the bow has a fish 5 feet under the surface

[Holi-e-Mackeral]

Dave,

You are the master... this is fantastic advice for all of us... I suggest we all print it out and read it to learn and most importantly utilize..

Keep the advice coming....

Now,

A story to illustrate somthing Dave told me many years ago...

While at the HB, the fishing was very, very slow.. almost dead.. Guys were dropping down to their lighter gear 80 # even 60 # just to get bit...

I see Dave walk to the rail, he looks at the puny gear I have put into the water and asks me what I will do if I hook a big fish... ???? He then says that they will bite the big gear... if I choose a good bait and present it properly...

I then see him, grab his big gear, pin on a lively bait, cast out, and hook the first fish in many hours fishing the heaviest gear in the water..

The moral of the story, if everyone fishes the proper gear, the fish will bite it, also going lite to get bit is a receipe for disaster and lost fish..

Tight lines.. Jeff

[Alaska4me]

When David speaks of tuna and gear one would be wise to listen! As far as printing the info out, amen to that brother! In 2000 David and others (Willy, et.al.) posted numerous articles covering a huge amount of info on Tuna and wahoo fishing. I was smart enough to print it al out, think it is about 200-250 pages long. With my 11 day trip coming up I read and re-read that book often, and yet still feel like I know nothing at all. Best solution: listen to the crew, take my book with me and read it at night to see if I could have improved over my performance that day.
I do have a fighting belt and might try it this trip but I will concentrate on using the rail and developing that technique. Dennis Braid has a great style using the fighting belt.
As far as tangles, it will happen. I was under the impression that when crossed you should relax the drag so no one gets sawed off, once free go back to fighting the fish with the drag set again. Was I misunderstanding that?
David has been very helpful over the past few years and has provided a lot of valuable information. I hope someday I can ride on a trip with him and tap his brain for more.