Question? Titanium Guides

Dohboy · Jun-10-2008, 03:00 PM

I am about to start a heavy jigging rod for a mate and he was thinking about using titanium guides, my question is how strong are the frames?

I am looking at the Fuji TILNGG#U with matching tops. I did notice that in the Mud hole catalog the 'U' stands for ultralight ring, so how strong are the frames?

The other option is the American Tackle GNIC but they dont make matching tops, are the tops they suggest the same colour?

The rod will be very sort at about 5'6" but will be fished using 37kg braid and the reel will be fished with up to 25Kg of drag.

This is the sort of rod but an overhead reel.
YouTube - dog tooth jigging

Dean

stp · Jun-10-2008, 03:09 PM

Dean,

Why not look into the same Ti guides that Seeker uses on their Super Seeker rods.....They are solid and would be perfect for a rod like that.

ifishinxs · Jun-10-2008, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dohboy

I am about to start a heavy jigging rod for a mate and he was thinking about using titanium guides, my question is how strong are the frames?

I am looking at the Fuji TILNGG#U with matching tops. I did notice that in the Mud hole catalog the 'U' stands for ultralight ring, so how strong are the frames?

The other option is the American Tackle GNIC but they dont make matching tops, are the tops they suggest the same colour?

The rod will be very sort at about 5'6" but will be fished using 37kg braid and the reel will be fished with up to 25Kg of drag.

This is the sort of rod but an overhead reel.
YouTube - dog tooth jigging

Dean

The Titaniums will work fine...But also look at the Fuji USG's for the heavy stuff

Capt. G · Jun-10-2008, 09:21 PM

Having built and sold quite a few rods here in Japan, with all types of Fuji Guides, but percentage wise (is that even a word?) mostly titanium, I can make the following observations:
1,We get alot of 'bent' guides that can be straightened out (carfully) and no need to re-wrap.
2. the above type of guide damage with the titanium results in a broken frame, or when we try to re-bend, results in breakage.
3. We have more cracked SiC rings with titanium frames, posible because the material is s hard, that it does not 'give' as much.

I do not think you will have any problem with the guides you inquired about from pulling on big fish, etc. I would be more concerned with damage to to 'boat rash' (stepping on a guide, etc.)

The seeker guides mentioned sound interesting; maybe the poster can give you more infor on them.

Hope your rod turns out nice.

Comedie · Jun-10-2008, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Capt. G

Having built and sold quite a few rods here in Japan, with all types of Fuji Guides, but percentage wise (is that even a word?) mostly titanium, I can make the following observations:
1,We get alot of 'bent' guides that can be straightened out (carfully) and no need to re-wrap.
2. the above type of guide damage with the titanium results in a broken frame, or when we try to re-bend, results in breakage.
3. We have more cracked SiC rings with titanium frames, posible because the material is s hard, that it does not 'give' as much.

I do not think you will have any problem with the guides you inquired about from pulling on big fish, etc. I would be more concerned with damage to to 'boat rash' (stepping on a guide, etc.)

The seeker guides mentioned sound interesting; maybe the poster can give you more infor on them.

Hope your rod turns out nice.

Your observations are backed by the properties of titanium. I believe all the guides use CP (commercially pure). It easily microfractures and fatigues (like a windshield, jut a nick will start the process). It is a poor heat conductor, so rings and their adhesives are denied a heatsink and subjected to more extreme temps. It is realtively soft and galls easily. And while strong for its weight, it is not as strong as stainless in the same size.

Really too bad no one makes guides of Inconel.

flamekeeper · Jun-10-2008, 11:19 PM

ATC- GNIC GUIDES ,They have matching Stainless tops of gold as well as the NIC, black. ATC will stand behind them 100%, super light. pretty nice guides imo.

stp · Jun-11-2008, 11:27 AM

I don't have much info on the guides, I just own a super seeker from Seeker, not custom wrapped, and it has some nice, strong looking, Ti guides with the Nanolite inserts.

Check out their website if you want to see them.

Capt. G · Jun-12-2008, 07:26 AM

Damn, Dohboy, I forgot to mention the most important thing--The T1LNGG has a gold ring that will groove with braid. When they first came out, there were huge problems with them here in Japan due to people using Pe, Spectra line with them. I have repaired countless grooved guides here. Fuji said they 'fixed' the problem, but know one uses them here for anything except mono line.
Pls. check this out before you put them on.
If I were building the rod, I would use the 'MN' guide instead of the 'LN' guide. This guide ONLY comes in with a SiC ring, not the gold ring. This alone should tell us that the gold ring only being offered on the light 'LN' type, and not the Ocean Version, as Fuji calls their 'MN' guide in the 2008 Japanese catalog, in not really suitable for saltwater fishing with heavy line, regardless if it is braid or not.

Comedie · Jun-12-2008, 08:21 AM

Capt G.... if Fuji says they fixed it, then that seems to say they had substandard ceramic material in the ring.
As a guess, the grooved guides were more from surf guys? The spectra material is UHMW PE, which isn't all that hard compared to ring materials. But if it picks up and carries something like sand or mud then it could be a pretty effective abrasive band.

Billy 40 · Jun-12-2008, 09:24 AM

CApt G - I think they only offer the Gold Cermet on the Titanium framed guides. The MN's are not Titanium (for what reason, I have no fukking clue but it's about time they made them). There used to be LRGG's - the big Long range guides with Gold Cermet rings, which were only made for teh Australian market I think. Sangeroo from Allcoast got his hands on a few sets of these a few years back, and from what he posted, he had been using Cermet prior to that with no problems.

THat is the first I heard Fuji Gold Cermet having a problem with grooving, I know a few people who use them on their rods, and fish with them who have never had a problem. I do know teh other companies Gold plated ring were a much different story.

Capt. G · Jun-12-2008, 10:05 AM

I just wanted to give Dohboy the heads up and to look into it before actually putting them on rods. The several hundred rods I have seen with problems with (grooving and cracking) of the Gold ring Fuji guids were on freshwater bass rods.
The 'M' guides (the saltwater version of the 'N' guide) do not come in Titanium for a reason--breakage and cracking with that style and shape of guide. At least that is what the Japanese Fuji Rep told me.
Also, the titanium does not really have the weight advantage over regular 'N'. I offer the same rod with either titanium or regular 'N' guides. It is amost impossible to tell the difference when holding the rod in a fishing postiton.
Just my ten cents...

Billy 40 · Jun-12-2008, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Capt. G

The 'M' guides (the saltwater version of the 'N' guide) do not come in Titanium for a reason--breakage and cracking with that style and shape of guide. At least that is what the Japanese Fuji Rep told me.

That's odd, since they offer Titanium in T-LCSG - which is a substantially heavier guide than a T-MNSG would be.

Unfortuntely I did not weigh any regular N framed guide, and only one size of the T-NSG, but....
TNSG 10 = .024oz
TLNSG 10 = .016oz
BLNAG 10 = .024oz
BMNAG 10 = .03oz
CMNAG = .032oz
MNSG 10 = .029oz

If I remember when I get home, I might have some regular NLG's laying around, as well as TNSG 12 & 16's I could weigh.