i'm a big fan of the crippled look, you guys have some nice lure set ups!!!
i'm surprised alot of the hawaii guys have shown lures and pics, alot of the guys i know hide their lures before they go out and stow them prior to coming back, you ask them what lures they run and they tell you "secret". this is how i like the hawaii board to run, people showing what works for them and hooking eachother up.
I agree. Now when I am over there and the locals start that shit I make sure every one that wants info gets it. I will tell any one were, what and how.
Wha kine chasebait you usin' on that bar in the picture with the mahi? Can't tell for sure, but doesn't look like the hollow squid chasebait we rig them with? 'Course, that's fine with us and some really like the idea of running a favorite lure that they like a lot in that position.
First is the pics of the Super Ninjas 9". Super Sexy!!
Second is the Ninja 6.5", looks like an albie killer. But they'll eat anything .
that little Ninja looks like an awesome trolling lure to use when I troll with a big flyrod while scooting from spot to spot........very nice, I gotta get my hands on a couple of those.
One thing I've always wondered about....I notice some of the lures in this thread place the hook just beyond the edge of the skirt so it's totally exposed and some place it just inside the edge of the skirt. Is there a reason for that? Does the longer trailing hook stick more short strikers? Just curious.................
awesome stuff guys. Flyfisherman can learn a lot from you dudes!
Don't worry about asking questions, there are many here who are willing to try to help. And don't knock being a fly fishermen. They learn a lot of good things that many salt water guys miss, like reading the water and fishing where the fish are, instead of all over the place, studying the fish' prey and matching the various hatches the right ways and with the right flies, some of which many tie themselves, lot's of good stuff that you'd be surprised how many salt water guys ignore - not all, but a goodly number of them.
You are probably going to get a lot of answers on this hook positioning question, because there are many opinions on the subject. I am somewhat of an outlaw in this regard, as well as many others, but here is what my experience has taught me...
Basically I use the rule of thumb that the faster a lure is going to be trolled, the further back I place my hook (I only use singles - no doubles, ever. Why is in the books. There's a target for some flaming, but please remember, I'm talking about me and how I do things. If others don't agree, no prob). High speed wahoo fishing is where I place my hook the furthest back and outside the skirt by a little bit. That's because at speeds of sixteen knots and more, wahoo hit a bait differently than they hit slower trolled ones, where I believe that they strike the head/gill/heart area first in order to immediately kill their prey and then they chop it up into smaller pieces to eat. If they were to hit a squid in particular in the "feet", all that they'd do is give it a piscatorial hotfoot and that squid could squirt away and escape, or a waiting bird, dolphin, or other predator fish could snap it up on them. I strongly believe that predatory gamefish live by the rule of the jungle..."Eat it NOW, before something else does!"
When it comes to the true high speed baits, I hang the hook out back because from what I've seen over and over again is that the wahoo usually comes from behind and bites the tail of the fleeing bait to cripple and stop it, then turns on and chops it up and eats it - fast! As it is with the slower speed bites, where most of the wahoo that I've caught have come in from the side, this happens very, very fast.
I rig my standard marlin lures "scorpion style" with the hook placed right behind the head and in the middle of what I believe to be that initial target area for most fish, the head/gill/heart one. The hook is locked in the upright position for sticking the fish and pulls out after the hookup so the lure can slide up the leader and not provide any weight to help the fish throw the hook when it jumps. I experimented for several years down in Cabo to come up with this rig and how to fish it right and it is killer. You have probably heard about the billfish abundance down there and that allowed me the opportunity to try this rigging out on truly vast numbers of sails, stripers, and good numbers of blues and blacks. And it proved itself on the meat fish too, including the wahoos. This is by no means a popular rigging, so be forewarned that it's going to get more than a few boo's here. Doesn't matter a dang to me...I don't sell marlin lures or hook rigs, so whatever anyone wants to do is fine with me. I'm listening to what those big numbers of billfish taught me down south, thankee.
Okay, here are some shots from my books on some of this stuff. That third picture down is a lure that I have rigged in the high speed style, but a close look will show the bite marks on the head and the skirt repair jobs caused by wahoo bites at "regular" speeds, when it was Scorpion rigged behind the head. There are also a lot of bill scars. Those who have been around marlin lures for a while will recognize this one as a Sevenstrand Kona Clone. That lure in this color was so effective in The Baja that we gave it a code name for when we were on the VHF and talking with buds about what we were catching fish on - with about a hundred competitors listening in. We called it "Puto", which if you don't know your Spanglish slang, means, well, uh, you know, it's a pink and pretty and, umm, kinda gay looking to that macho crowd down there. I don't mean to offend, but that's in fact what we called it.
The last shot is a full-blown, scorpion rigged lure.
Hope this helps a little and I'm looking forward to how others answer this good question that you raised. Just remember, this is how I do it and these are my opinions and I'm not telling or suggesting that anyone has to go along with me. And one more thing. I developed the Scorpion thing many years ago. With the exception of high speed wahoo fishing, I only fish circle hooks on my lures and have for a very long time now and the vast majority of my trolling starting long ago has been bait and switch fishing with bars. I actually don't even fish marlin lures anymore, including my own.
Wha kine chasebait you usin' on that bar in the picture with the mahi? Can't tell for sure, but doesn't look like the hollow squid chasebait we rig them with? 'Course, that's fine with us and some really like the idea of running a favorite lure that they like a lot in that position.
Thanks!
Futa Stinger
Captain Fred thats a Futa Lure I think it's a Stinger but I'm not positive on that. This year I'm gonna change it out to a Futa Mac which has popping and slashing action. I've been noticing on some of the fishing shows on tv that a lot of the predators will slash or zig zag before striking bait or lures, so maybe the slashing and popping if the Futa Mac will trigger some more strikes? We'll see. I did re-rig your bars with different colored squids to "match the hatch" and they've worked great for me. I'll post more photos on that later.
Thanks for the detailed response Fred...........your explanation on the "whys" of hook placement makes perfect sense to me. I was shocked to see the circle hook on your scorpion-rigged lure. that is the first time I've seen one on a trolling lure. I have tried a few flies tied on circle hooks but the takes were on the pause/strip/pause method or on a dead drifted fly, never one trolled or stripped quickly with a steady retrieve.
Thank you for the response. I have been fishing with circle hooks in all of my lures for well over fifteen years now. And they work...great! And believe me, I wouldn't have used them on a busy, high dig charterboat in an intensely competitive venue like Cabo if I wasn't convinced that they were better than J-hooks. I used them because they work so well, it's almost impossible to lose fish on them, and they are kind to released fish and the mates doing the releasing. All good. I had nothing to gain in any ways other than the ones mentioned for using them.
Jonesy,
Thanks for the heads up on that Futa lure you were running behind the bar. Man, it's a sweet, fishy-looking little thing and it looks like it's a great chasebait. I never saw one of those before, but I have run Ron's Little Reide behind little bars and we really tore some fish up with that combo. Wahoo, in particular, really went for it, but so did the marlin. Much as I like running other stuff behind bars, I still believe that the right hollow squid is hard to beat, but I'm pleased that people can run whatever they like back there.
Thanks guys! (And I hope that wind stops blowing for ya!)
Nice old D. Odagiri smoker head. I must have lost several to ono chomps. Lots of marlin cracks on those kind on the corner, but I don't get much production from ahi piles with them.
Aloha guys new to this forum fish out of waianae and town wanted to share some of my lures with you i had them out to pick out some for the Hanapaa shoot out!!!!
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