Avet Binding????

[Flagtails50]

Thinking about buying one of the new Raptor reels but I hear so much about a "binding" issue with the Avet reels when using higher drag settings.

What is this problem? Can anyone describe it for me.

I've never owned one (an Avet) and the reels that I currently have (Daiwa Saltiga's and Accurate's) don't seem to suffer from these problems.

Do the new Raptor's suffer from this?

Thanks,

Juan

[AKSalmon]

Binding is when at high drag pressures, the pinion gear presses too hard against the pinion bearing and makes it hard to run the handle. This happens with most lever drag reels but seems to kick in more often when Avets are pushed too hard. The design of the Raptor is supposed to prevent this, and I can't imagine it ever happening on an Accurate. It doesn't bother everyone but does bother me, and is the main reason I replaced my HX with a two speed Accurate 665. But again: It won't happen unless you try to push your reel a bit harder than you should.

[BOILER]

Originally Posted by AKSalmon

Binding is when at high drag pressures, the pinion gear presses too hard against the pinion bearing and makes it hard to run the handle. This happens with most lever drag reels but seems to kick in more often when Avets are pushed too hard. The design of the Raptor is supposed to prevent this, and I can't imagine it ever happening on an Accurate. It doesn't bother everyone but does bother me, and is the main reason I replaced my HX with a two speed Accurate 665. But again: It won't happen unless you try to push your reel a bit harder than you should.

He is right, doesn't happen with the Accurates. This has long been a problem with Avets, I guess the old saying you get what you pay for doesn't apply in this case now does it.

[OFN]

Never had an issue with any of my Avets binding. But I am old school and buy my reels for specific line classes, and fish them within spec, and maintain them properly. The new raptor series look very interesting, and I am looking forward to trying them. If you have deep pockets and money is no object certainly take a look at the Accurates. In my opinion Avet provides better bang for the buck, but you know what they say about opinions.

[coryellk]

Avets underengineered the pinion bearing and one result of this is that handle pressure and premature bearing failure prevent someone from using the reel outside of it's prescribed line class. Intentional or not, this bugs some people, myself included. This said, if you use the reel in it's intended line class, you shouldn't have any problems. You'll just need to buy Avets for each and every line class that you want to fish. No biggie if you have deep pockets... and you never pickup and Accurate, ProGear, Tiburon, or Saltiga!!

[BOILER]

Yeah What Kevin said!!! In my opinion as well to go along with OFN but with a different reel best bang for your buck would be the new Daiwa Saltists 2-speed reels. No binding issues the more drag you apply, freespool just as good and are cheaper. JSR just fished the 30 at the Lupe and killed 65lb tuna with these no problems. Avets were priced cheaper in the past but now have suddenly started to get expensive.

[eteo]

Boiler, which Tackle Shop do you work at?

[eteo]

Your posts on various boards leave the impression that you may work for a tackle shop.

[MARKEY220]

it does if your comparing it to an accurate....

[Double Z]

Originally Posted by BOILER

Yeah What Kevin said!!! In my opinion as well to go along with OFN but with a different reel best bang for your buck would be the new Daiwa Saltists 2-speed reels. No binding issues the more drag you apply, freespool just as good and are cheaper. JSR just fished the 30 at the Lupe and killed 65lb tuna with these no problems. Avets were priced cheaper in the past but now have suddenly started to get expensive.

I'm not sure about the Daiwa's yet. Some of the early reports suggest not only handle pressure but other complaints. I'd like to look inside the Daiwa's first.

I seems like the only consistent issue with Avet's was/is the handle pressure when over fished. Say what you want but Accurate's fail too when over fished. They just had more drag before failing. The new Avet's seem to have increased their drag to or near that level. They are still cheaper and still made in America. Oh, and the spools are lighter than the Accurate's so should cast lighter weights better.

[BOILER]

Originally Posted by Double Z

I'm not sure about the Daiwa's yet. Some of the early reports suggest not only handle pressure but other complaints. I'd like to look inside the Daiwa's first.

I seems like the only consistent issue with Avet's was/is the handle pressure when over fished. Say what you want but Accurate's fail too when over fished. They just had more drag before failing. The new Avet's seem to have increased their drag to or near that level. They are still cheaper and still made in America. Oh, and the spools are lighter than the Accurate's so should cast lighter weights better.

Very true DoubleZ, I have had them fail on me in the past, although they were 1st gen models and I haven't had them fail on me since. I have also had Avets fail. All reels are mechanical and capable of failing. The one thing that Avet has going for them is the fact that there reels are a little more sloppy and not so tightly built which doesn't make them high maintenance. Accurates need to be serviced regularly (once a year depending on how much you fish) to mantain peak performance. Contrary to popular belief I don't think Avets suck, I don't fish them anymore, but I don't think they suck.

[finadict]

[/QUOTE] I seems like the only consistent issue with Avet's was/is the handle pressure when over fished. Say what you want but Accurate's fail too when over fished. They just had more drag before failing. The new Avet's seem to have increased their drag to or near that level. They are still cheaper and still made in America. Oh, and the spools are lighter than the Accurate's so should cast lighter weights better.[/QUOTE]

This is true!
The term "binding" is a bit misleading..there is no contact with moving parts or rubbing when this happens. What you are feeling when very heavy drag pressure is applied is added drag from lateral load on a radial bearing. It is not the pinion gear bearing that you feel, its the outside spool bearing. When the Drag lever is applied, the cam pulls a drawbar that goes through the pinion gear bearing, the pinion gear, the drag plate, the spool, to the outside spool bearing. This compresses the spool to the dragplate. When the drag and spool are compressed the load is equally distributed between the pinion gear bearing and the outside spool bearing. The pinion gear bearing is housed in the drive-side plate and is much larger than the spool bearings, and capable of taking much higher side loads. The outside spool bearing is much smaller.

The outside spool bearing was intentionally engineered smaller than the pinion bearing to reduce rotational mass of the spool and reduce the rotational drag of a larger bearing to make a lighter better casting spool. The smaller diameter spool bearing also allows a smaller diameter spool hub for it to fit into, creating much more line capacity for an overall smaller, lighter spool.

It would have been much easier to use the same outside spool bearing as the pinion bearing...fewer parts to stock, simpler engineering and machining, as all the bores would be the same...etc..but the reel wouldnt cast anywhere near as well..and the overall size of the reel would have to be significantly larger and heavier to get the same line capacities. For a great casting, small light leverdrag its a great design, and using a reel within the limits it was designed for its a small trade-off to have it all.

With the new Raptor reels, the lateral load issue is eliminated using a different drag compression configuration...keeping similar bearings and spool/reel dimentions.